4.8.21
In this episode The Propcast talks to Julian Brockhurst and Isaac Coonan, from PropTech Brisbane and Aprao, about Brisbane as a PropTech hub, tips for start-ups planning to launch in Australia, and who is leading the way in Australia’s PropTech space.
Isaac Coonan
https://www.linkedin.com/in/isaacjholmyard/?originalSubdomain=au
Isaac has extensive experience in building some of the countries leading innovation and tech communities with a particular focus and passion for the property technology cluster. Isaac is currently the Senior Industry Development Manager for Brisbane Economic Development Agency, leading the city of Brisbane’s PropTech strategy along with being a global advisor to Second Century Ventures and their accelerator program, REACH. Isaac started PropTech Brisbane in efforts to demonstrate the diversity in talent with in the Brisbane property technology cluster and to act as a centralised point of promotion, amplification and education for the sector.
Julian Brockhurst
https://www.linkedin.com/in/julianbrockhurst/?originalSubdomain=au
Julian is focused on the intersection of real estate, technology and ESG with the goal of creating a grander built environment. Through PropTech Brisbane and initiatives guiding some of the most promising PropTech scale-up companies across APAC, Julian promotes how to create a place of the future throughout the design, build and operational property lifecycle stages. Julian has a deep background of 10+ years expanding businesses and building networks across international markets such as the UK, US, and Australia. Naturally inquisitive and a lifelong learner, his goal is to combine domain experience and expertise within the property sector to help drive innovation.
Louisa Dickins
https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisa-dickins-ab065392/?originalSubdomain=uk
Louisa started her career in property working at a well-known estate agency in London. Realising her people skills, she moved over to Lloyd May to pursue a career in recruitment. She now is a Director at LMRE, who are a specialist recruitment firm driven by PropTech and recruitment professionals, and Louisa oversees their 5 core areas. Louisa co-founded LMRE and provides a constructive recruitment platform to the new disruptors in real estate. Louisa is also on the board of Directors at UK PropTech Association (UKPA).
About LMRE
LMRE believe there is a better way to recruit. LMRE focus on a more comprehensive, client led focus delivering exceptional talent to the place at the time. They are passionate about the industry and passionate about people’s careers. LMRE spend time with each client to become and an extension of the business, and their transparency and core values help them grow with the sector. LMRE simplify recruitment and innovate with our clients and evolve the people driven, PropTech community.
Resources Referenced
LMRE website www.lmre.tech
PropTech Brisbane www.proptechbne.com
Aprao website www.aprao.com
Louisa
Hi everyone and welcome to The Propcast. My name is Louisa Dickins, host of The Propcast and co-founder of LMRE, the global PropTech recruitment and search consultancy. In this podcast we will explore how the digital evolution of the real estate industry is impacting the property market. The aim of each episode is to introduce you to a PropTech innovator and discuss how their work has created a shift in focus when it comes to digitising the built environment.
Shameless plug, but I’m honoured to be a judge at this years 8th annual Real Estate Tech Awards, hosted by CREtech. Applications are closing soon so head to their website to apply and I look forward to awarding a prize to one of you in October. If you’re interested in finding out more about PropTech, or applying for a job in this space, or keen to know who the big players are that are moving and shaking the real estate industry up, we have you covered and we’ll be bringing you an episode each week to connect you with the VCs, PropTech start-ups and real estate professionals from around the globe. Also a big shout out to our sponsors of the podcast ReimTech and CREtech who you will hear from during the episode.
Hi, everyone and welcome to The Propcast. Today we will be on PropTech down under and we’ll be joined by Isaac Coonan and Julian Brockhurst all the way from Australia, so welcome to the show guys.
Isaac
Thank you very much for having me. It’s a delight to be here, my name’s Isaac and I’m the founder of PropTech Brisbane.
Julian
Yes, amazing to be here today guys, Julian from PropTech Brisbane and Aprao as well.
Louisa
Awesome thanks for joining us. And so for our listeners, Isaac has an extensive background in emerging technology sector with a focus on supporting their global emerging PropTech economy through creating bespoke opportunities for education, development and customer acquisition pathways. Isaac as he just mentioned is a founder PropTech Brisbane and the senior Industry Development Manager for Technology at the Brisbane Economic Development Agency. Now both of these roles see Isaac’s timing utilised to develop high impact initiatives connecting the built environment industry with the emerging technology cluster in the capital city of Queensland Brisbane.
Julian, who is also joining us is currently the APAC business development lead for Aprao, which is a UK founded cloud based tool transforming the way real estate industry creates and manages development feasibility reports. Julian has over 10 years experience expanding businesses and building networks across international markets such as UK, US and Australia. Naturally inquisitive and a lifelong learner, his goal to combine domain experience and expertise within the property sector and to drive innovation. And Julian is also director PropTech Brisbane, and spends his time guiding some of the most promising PropTech scale up companies across APAC, which I’m sure we’ll hear a little bit more about later. But without further ado welcome to the show again, guys. And let’s start with the questions. So Isaac, why don’t you tell us a bit more about how you got into PropTech, a little bit more about your role? And I’m super interested in the parts to do with education as well. Tell us your story.
Isaac
Absolutely. So for me, my entrance into the big wide world of PropTech didn’t actually come from the property sector, it actually came from the technology sector. I have had a lot of experience working for a number of Australian incubators, co working space accelerator programs, all really focused on supporting technology agnostic companies.
So anything from creative tech to agricultural tech, to fintech to PropTech. However, it was within my role at Queensland University of Technology, that I really started to dig my teeth into the PropTech sector. And I saw the potential of what the emerging technology cluster for property was really doing. My experience in the property sector really kind of demonstrated that there was nothing but room for improvement when it came to the digital adoption, or technology adoption within the traditional industry. And the emerging technology cluster were creating phenomenal tools, but they had no real way to actually articulate that value to the property sector. And so where I saw a massive gap in the market was to really understand enough about the property industry, the property sector their needs, their desires, their pain points, to be able to articulate that to technology cluster and then also understand enough about the emerging technology products and innovations that were being created to translate that to the property economy.
So I kind of sit in this wonderfully weird place about knowing enough about both sides of the coin, to ensure that they’re able to communicate with each other in a way that actually drives adoption, that drives outcomes. And my experience I suppose in the educational side has really been centred purely around that. I’ve never been in the business of helping technology companies to create better technology solutions, nor have I ever worked on the property sector for them to create better best practices or baseline principles. It’s really been around educating both sides of this PropTech coin to ensure that they’re able to communicate, collaborate and work with each other in an efficient way. 4.43 So yes as you said, I am the founder of PropTech Brisbane, which is a community group centred around bringing visibility and transparency along with amplification to the greater Brisbane PropTech region, along with supporting the property sector we have here. My role within Brisbane Economic Development Agency has me acting on behalf of the Lord Mayor of Brisbane City Council really driving the focus of property technology as a leading industry vertical for the city of Brisbane. So yes, that’s kind of in a roundabout long winded way, how I got into PropTech.
Louisa
Awesome. And yes, it’s interesting what you’re saying about communicating, educating, having that balance between the technology side and the real estate side. There’s a limited amount of industry folks who have that at the moment. And this whole podcast is about bridging that gap. I mean, that’s in our intro and so I’m sure we have a hell of a lot to learn from you. And Julian, tell us about you because we’ve got lots in common you were previously a Reach mentor, you now are the APAC Business Development Lead for Dan’s business Aprao, I love Dan and love what he’s doing. Tell us how you got into it.
Julian
Yes, sure I mean, I started at QUT where Isaac was involved in that education side as a student, studying property economics and swiftly went overseas to the UK and completely left that whole degree behind and moved into a start-up but in the e-travel world, and creating experiences and events across Europe and looking to exit to one of the big online travel brands such as hotels.com. That was a really, really good introduction, especially fresh out of university, an introduction to the start-up world. But also in probably what was a more mature market, then what PropTech is, or especially was when I jumped in. So you kind of saw how it was evolving after a few years. And then I got the opportunity to go to New York and join a flexible workspace provider and this was during the heyday of Wework when Wework was still really, really big and powerful and pre IPO and all the rest of it that’s fallen out. And it was an exciting time to try and help landlords and educate them around the advantages of flexible office space, the advantages of shorter term leases, this workforce that today doesn’t want to work from home, from the office for a while downtown uptown, midtown, whatever it may be, is really helping to strengthen their portfolios and make them a lot more sticky with some of the tenants that were roaming around New York City at the time.
And I remember, that really put me in touch with a lot of property people within New York. And being such a hub of PropTech, I was pretty naive or green to the PropTech world at that point. But over those two years I did spend in New York, that was when I really sunk my teeth into it. I can still remember sitting in Midtown one night after I got an invite from a colleague of mine to go to a Metaprop pitch event. Which that first night, I had no idea what I was getting myself into. And I just remember sitting there amazed at the pitches from various different companies solving various different problems. And some of them went completely over my head and others, I was like, I can absolutely see how that would work and why isn’t that a huge company right now? Why is there only two people standing in front of me with a laptop? And so that really, really piqued the interest. And so when moving back to Australia, that was exactly the space I wanted to put myself in. That kind of intersection of property, technology, and then also that model of sustainability or ESG point. And everyone has to pick that battle I think in this, or the sustainability and that climate change movement, whether it’s fighting trash or plastic reducing emissions, but I think if we can use space and buildings which we live, work and play in, in a more efficient manner, build them in a more efficient manner, then that’s going to go a long way to solving those issues. So that was really why I have focused on PropTech as an industry and ecosystem and how I got involved.
Louisa
Yes. And you have recently joined Aprao, Dan’s team. How did that come about? Isaac, I think you mentioned it might have been through an introduction through PropTech Brisbane. But what’s your role at Aprao?
Julian
Yes, so Aprao for those that don’t know very quickly, is a cloud based financial feasibility and modelling tool for feasibilities property developments. And it’s really going to take that to a whole another level with its cloud based digital native. And we’ll start having a lot more plugins with other players within the ecosystem to have more data enriched logic based decisions around the feasibilities. And so Dan and the team have been doing really well in the UK, and we’re looking to come into APAC. And so I think got in touch with Isaac and was looking for someone down here and at the time I found myself looking for a new project and it was right place right time. And so today the mandate is really to expand that across cross APAC. I think there’s an initial focus on ANZ, Australia and New Zealand and it’s going really well. I mean, the property market has just rebounded so quickly from COVID, with a dip and the government stimulus and a lot of hype around the property sector has meant there’s been a lot more developments in the pipeline, which is where Approa is really, really helping out.
Louisa
Yes. And for those listening, Julian Isaac are fortunate to be sitting next to each other in an office. And lots of our listeners, you guys are based across the US, UK and all of us are still in a little bit of a lockdown so all very envious. Now, Isaac, you mentioned PropTech Brisbane a little bit. And lots of these associations are popping up across the world, in each country, I’m involved in UKPA, there’s the PropTech Collective, there’s many. Tell us a bit more, what’s your associations and USP? What does it provide to community, who’s part of it and what’s the future plan to that?
Isaac
Great question. I think for us, what we really like at the very core of what we’re wanting to do with PropTech Brisbane is to bring visibility, transparency and amplification to the emerging PropTech sector here in Brisbane, whilst also connecting industry to the incredible PropTech network that exists within our local area. So I understand like PropTech Collective, the PropTech Association of Australia, PropTech Berlin, there is incredible networks and associations that exist to really service abroad regions/country, however we are really taking a city focus. We’re really wanting to champion a city’s involvement in the nurture and development of an emerging technology cluster, particularly when nearly every single city around the world, the largest contributor to their GDP is the property sector, the largest employer is the property of real estate sector. So it’s in the interest of cities and local government areas to really double down and support this sector the work being done by PropTech. So what we are centred to do is just bring, as I said, transparency, visibility and amplification.
We have got Proptechs, anyone from the really early stage companies looking to kind of get that initial validation, or that initial customer, all the way up to companies that are generating $5m+ annual revenue, who are just wanting to give back. So we’ve got that incredible mix of companies that are all wanting to really put their arms around each other and really create a community. On the flip side, we’ve got industry and that’s everything from the leading associations like Residential Real Estate Institute of Queensland, REIQ, the Property Council of Australia, the Urban Development Institute of Queensland, all the way down to some of our top projects. One of the initiatives that Julian actually ran earlier for us in this year was an initiative where we sourced some of the top PropTechs that had an interest in one of the city’s highest ranking development projects, which is Cross River Rail, which is for anyone who’s not aware is actually a $5 billion development project creating our underground rail network here in the city.
So we’ve built a relationship with Cross River Rail, we ask them, What are you guys needing from the way of emerging technologies to help manage your precincts, to help manage the development of your precincts in the planning process. And then what we did is we actually created an avenue and created an opportunity where our PropTech network are able to network with, engage with, shake hands with, and decision make at Cross River Rail. So for us, our sweet spot is less around the advocation and I suppose champion of legislation at a government level, which is where a lot of association fits, our sweet spot is, What huge projects or what industry groups do we have here in Brisbane that we can physically and tangibly bring in PropTech network and create avenues for technology adoption. So that’s where we sit, that’s where we play. We have a beautiful relationship with Kylie Davis, who started the PropTech Association of Australia. We’re absolutely not competitive with that because as I said, we really have a city focus on our initiative.
Louisa
Yes, I think those listening if you are in APAC, definitely speak to Kylie, she is queen of PropTech, a thought leader, and just all time power woman absolutely lovely. And I’m sure she will offer any advice for those looking to expand out Australia way. And now, let’s talk about the PropTech scene, how it’s developed. Maybe we’ll start off talking about the PropTech, and Julian did mention the ESG side of it, I know, in Australia as well there’s a massive growth of ConTech as well, you have LendLease which is headquartered in Australia,. Tell us a little bit more from your opinion who’s leading the way in terms of PropTech start-ups?
Julian
Broadly, I think Australia as PropTech scene, as it has globally has also taken off, and I think the momentum was definitely there pre COVID. It was getting a lot more of the investment dollars going its way, a lot more of the I guess the media attention, the big corporates were starting to pay attention, giving the start-ups that those pilots. And roles opening up within companies, head of PropTech, Chief Innovation Officer, Technology Officer, all these kind of roles. So that momentum was there and in a lot of ways especially in Australia, it was accelerated throughout COVID as we really had to figure out how to operate in a much more flexible and digital world as we are today over Zoom. And so I think that has really driven PropTech over the past 18 months, two years. And then we’ve seen like the emergence of dedicated PropTech accelerators, you’ve got the guys at Taronga and the Real Tech X Programme, REACH which Isaac is one of the directors of once upon a time. We’re also here as city initiatives that Isaac runs, as well. And then the association so as we just mentioned, a PropTech Association Australia and PropTech Brisbane.
So all of these things are really coming together and really bubbling at the moment. And so I think that it’s just like a really, really good environment for PropTech across Australia. And then I think the government support again, like throughout COVID really focused on the property sector at large. It really supported that, that was our way to overcome the potential recession, and all that stuff that was a result of COVID. So, property is in a really good position right now and some of the some of the ones that are really taking the lead, I mean in my mind, the three the top of my head are Archistar, Box Brownie and Equiem. And that ranges for I mean, Archistar just raised a big round really leading the way in a lot of areas, especially from the development side, Box Brownie I think they’re close to Isaac and I’s heart we came through the REACH program once upon a time, also based in Queensland. So it’s all southeast Queensland so we can definitely put them in the PropTech Brisbane bracket and an Equiem is doing really, really well and I think made a quite a sizable acquisition to gain market share across the UK. So for me, they’re the three big Proptechs themselves, but really hard to single anyone out there’s so many doing really, really well. I think it’s if you ask us this question in 12 months time, there’ll be a lot more on like that are doing some big, big numbers.
Louisa
Yes, I’m probably some pretty big US and European ones who are coming over who I’m actually working with at the moment but that’s top secret. And Isaac, why don’t we talk about the agencies and the consultancy side? I know Lendlease has been making some serious moves and they’re developing stuff in house, is JLL, Knightfrank, PWC, Deloitte, are they getting involved in the PropTech world, what are you seeing?
Isaac
Yes, they are. But I’m going to take this moment to say something potentially controversial. Also, reflecting on technology clusters and industries that have scaled before the PropTech sector, you look at the FinTech world, every consultancy firm, every major bank, everyone was trying to jump on it. But it was from more of a marketing campaign. It was from more of a Hey, we just want to be seen to be doing cool stuff. But the thought of actually investing in, adopting and working with emerging technologies, it’s too difficult. We just want to be seen doing it. And one thing I’ve definitely noticed, particularly here in Australia is there’s a lot of people who want to be seen. The hard part is, how do you navigate your way from understanding who wants to be seen versus who has a genuine interest in supporting this sector. You mentioned a couple phenomenal groups but top of my mind Charter Hall, the work that the Chief Technology and Chief Information Officer for that organisation is incredible. It’s not a marketing ploy, it’s not just something fun that you can stick on LinkedIn, she wants to bring these innovations and these technologies into a company like Charter Hall to really make sure that they’ve got a runway, to make sure that they have going to be able to create tangible ways to delight and excite the tenants within their company.
So I think if I was to say, who’s doing what in the consultancy world, the big four consultants, they’re always involved. They’re always a part of it, they’re always doing something and I love them for it. I think if you’re looking at the big commercial groups, absolutely Charter Hall is one to watch. They’re not pissing around, they are putting money where my mouth is and doubling down, which is a beautiful thing to see. If you look at the residential space, look take this with a hefty grain of salt because I’m based in Brisbane, which is the cap city of Queensland. But the work that Antonia and Rod are doing, the CEO and CFO of REIQ is phenomenal. They are not just supporting property technologies, they’re literally bringing Proptechs like Hutly, like Nextform, like so many other companies into their organisation to really demonstrate the potential to their members, to really demonstrate the potential to industry. They’re not they’re not taking a simple, Okay, we’ll give you a two minute speaking spot on stage. They’re really trying to dig deeper and say, What does your product do? Explain to us how that makes sense to industry and then we will explain to industry why they should be connecting with you. So you’ve got these industry champions that are really, really taking PropTech leaps and bounds forward in their journey, which in my mind that’s what it’s all about.
Louisa
Yes 100%. And you and Julian, you’re based in Brisbane, you mentioned another hub is Sydney. Say if a business was looking to launch in Australia, are those go to? There’s talk of Melbourne, where are the hubs?
Isaac
Now you’re asking this question to two people who are sharing in an office in Brisbane, so it’s very difficult for us to have an open mind but I’m going to do my absolute best! Melbourne, Brisbane and Adelaide do incredible work to support the PropTech sector and it would be a lie for me to say that there was one city that was really championing the sector more than another. What I will say about Brisbane is, you take into account the liveability, the feasibility and the actual construct of the city, it’s second to none in my opinion, but also in a lot of research. But then you also look at where the offices are. You’ve got headquarters for Harcourts, for Re/Max, for Ray White, for LJ Hooker, they’re all here in Brisbane. Then you also flip the switch and think commercial, you’ve got the technology teams of CBRE based here in Brisbane, you’ve got a massive amount of JLL’s resource based here in Brisbane. Brisbane actually has the industry decision makers right here in our city , you mentioned you’ve got Brisbane City Council saying no, no, no, this is an important sector, we’re going to double down in terms of financially supporting this ecosystem but also supporting the ecosystem in non financial ways. I’m not being biased. I’ve worked in PropTech here in Australia and all around the world. I actually haven’t ever seen a city say no, no, we want to claim this as ours. We want to claim Brisbane as the epicentre for prop tech and I’m kind of unapologetic in saying that but If you are a PropTech looking for Australia, have a chat to Julian and I. We’ll go wherever you need but there’s a really compelling case here in Brisbane.
Louisa
I’ve seen this across the US and I guess start-ups looking to scale and lots of people think, Okay, I have to go to SF or I have to go to New York. And now everyone’s looking like Denver, Colorado, people now actually having some of their salespeople based in Canada, because there’s an incredible, educated, hungry talent pool. And it’s not at the crazy salaries of New York and SF and I know from market research, salaries in Sydney are higher. And if we have all this remote work and you guys back in the office, but I think we are all coming back to this hybrid model, you probably don’t have to have someone based in these cities. My team are going to be based all over and probably some random suburbs across the world and so it’ll be interesting to see what happens to that in terms of start-up scaling when they’re looking to launch. Can we go into a little bit more about the ESG space? You mentioned the council’s looking to invest in technology support it, what have you seen in terms of growth there?
Julian
Yes, sure. I think ESG is just like you want to still call it a trend, it’s definitely not new, it’s been there for a while. The US has their 17 goals in place for a long time now. And I think everyone’s really waking up to enjoying the cause and getting behind it. And it’s no longer just because it’s a fad, it’s a marketing ploy, it’s starting to produce good returns as a good investment decision to get involved in this, and really champion the ESG goals. So I think that, again there’s a lot of companies that are going to be really focusing on that, I think a lot of it at the moment is around the construction side or up until the on the property perspective. But then just efficiently running just the big buildings, the commercial side of things. Like I think if you look at commercial, there’s a case to be made at the moment that ESG, it can really, really reduce the cost of operation, but then in some cases increase the revenue, which is giving you better margins.
And I think for the corporate guys and your office landlords, then at the moment, it seems like there’s just a real need to justify the value of the asset, with vacancies slowly grinding upwards, they need to figure out how to drive more revenue per square meter to again, justify the price they may have paid for a building at the end of 2019. Or think outside the box and really bring some more innovation into that space. And I think again, the ESGs are really going to help out there. And again notably one of the accelerators here in Australia Taronga their whole cohort, I think, in its entirety, is purely focused on ESG and the construction side. So if you’re seeing there’s big moves being made, it’s really, really encouraging. And I know that that’s a global trend. I know, that’s happening right across APAC North America and Europe. So it’s encouraging to see.
Louisa
Yes, no, definitely. Isaac, is there anything you want to build on that?
Isaac
I think Julian definitely covered it and I actually like what he said at the beginning about ESG, I think we need to move out of the realm of this becoming a trend. Because it’s not a trend, it actually is something that is so it does need to be so fundamental to us. And what I actually love about the emerging PropTech sector is more often than not, Proptechs tie into the ESG goals even when they don’t realise it. Because at the end of the day, digital and technology solutions solve a lot of the key pain points created in the way that we work the way they transact and engaged with real estate. So it’s actually kind of funny to see so many emerging PropTechs, not realising that they’re actually contributing to the ESG goals, and kind of educate them on that journey. But no, I think Julian articulated it in a beautiful way.
Louisa
I love how you support each other the bromance I can feel it! Okay, now let’s talk about start-ups launching in Australia. , if they launch they now have got to consider Brisbane and I can completely see why it’s definitely a hub of reasons to launch there. Are there any tips for people looking to launch in Australia? It’s very much about matter of speaking to all the key players out there, any success stories you can maybe mention, or do’s and don’ts?
Isaac
Yes, I’d be delighted to have a crack at this one first. Julian is a prime example of how it can work well with Aprao launching into this region, connecting with people on the ground, to understand the market, but then also find the right people to really champion your product here. We’re doing a lot at the moment on behalf of the City to really attract international companies to Australia and the prop tech sector. One of the companies in my most recent programs, the Brisbane EDA PropTech pilot program, Renti. They’re based in New Zealand, and they are expanding their products they’re going guns blazing in New Zealand, but they’re expanding their product to Australia. And this is genuine feedback but a few things that I found really helpful is just being able to have conversations with people on the ground, and just kind of being able to have conversations with trusted people who are in the industry. And I think what’s really daunting to PropTech founders and PropTechs who are looking to scale internationally, is if you haven’t spent time there, if you don’t know the market, if you don’t know the players, how are you going to make the right hire? How are you going to make the right business decision? How are you going to create the right partnerships.
So if I was a PropTech not based in Australia, looking to scale, I would say, as I as you rightfully said, ping Kylie Davis from the prop tech association of Australia, Julian and I love a phone call, speak to a few trusted people here, we’re not going to take you for every dollar. We’re not going to going to use it as a consulting firm, we’ve got a genuine interest in supporting the development of the PropTech economy here in Australia. We’re not doing you a favour, if anything, you’re doing us a favour, we want you here, we want you to come. So if you are generally interested, the first point of call in my opinion is always do your research and figure out who the trusted people are. Second to that. My second point would be hire the right first person. I think Renti has done a phenomenal job with hiring their business development manager for Australia. She has just done a phenomenal job building her Renti’s network, slightly biased because Julian’s here, but Aprao did a pretty good job of hiring, he was able to rapidly build the brand and rapidly build the networks for a company based in the UK, here in Australia. So when it comes to hiring your first person, my two cents worth would be don’t go out of the line, speak to the people who have avenues or have a network that they can recommend the right people because Australia more than anywhere around the world is relationship based. If you get a bad apple as your first hire, I’m really sorry, but you are not going to be able to succeed here in Australia.
Louisa
This is in a lot of countries, the PropTech community as it grows it’s still fairly small, it’s tight. Everyone knows everyone so I completely echo everything Isaac said. And LMRE is literally about to begin in soft launch there, I guess we’re not a proper tech company but we’ve been being basically growing cross APAC, and we will be fully launched in the next week. So if you are looking for your first feet of the ground, speak to Julian, Isaac, Kylie, and the other four leads in Australia but also definitely give an LMRE an email or call. And now Julian and Isaac we’re coming to the end of the podcast but don’t worry, we still got the LMRE part. So L is lessons learned, M it’s mention anyone or shout out to certain product, and Julian, you don’t shout out to Aprao ideally! R any regrets in your career, but a positive spin on it and E what are you most excited about the future of PropTech? Julian, what’s the biggest lesson you’ve learned so far in your career?
Julian
I think you learn a lesson every day in every interaction, every company I’ve ever worked for. But I guess the theme and as cliche as it might sound is just nothing in the moment remains the same. And the lesson is that if you’re really married to the old school way, the legacy way of doing things, especially in the property sector, which has been a bit of a laggard in its adoption, I think it’s quickly changing and if you’re not changing along with it, changing is just keeping up with the norm. A lot of people think if they change one thing that’s going to set them up for the next 10 years and then that that’s all I have to do. But it’s this consistent change in innovation. And again, mentioning a few of the big roles that are going within the big corporates, that that role is really being championed at the moment. And it’s an understanding of innovation is key to our core products, we need to continuously do it. And so it’s just been a lesson in my career so far as to say, just keep trying things. It’s not always going to work out and it shouldn’t be the expectation that it does. I mean, that’s just the whole point of it.
Louisa
Isaac, what about you, what lessons have you learned?
Isaac
Look, the number one lesson that I’ve learned that I probably went to my first year working in the industry, and then I learned it everyday sense, is this is a relationship game. But not just real estate, not just PropTech, but the business economy is built on relationships. And I think, now more than ever, with the continual adoption of technology and the continual advancements of technology being the being the sharpest get on the block is still cool. But it’s no longer the be all and end all. It’s your ability to build and manage meaningful relationships, that is really going to set you and your business apart. And I think that not enough people in the PropTech sector, particularly in the PropTech support sector understand that you’re not going to make a quick buck out of this industry. This isn’t something you can charge every cent of your time for, this is a relationship play, this is a long term play. And if you’re in it for a quick win, maybe it’s time to move on. 36.408 gram
Louisa
We’ve mentioned quite a few products already, I guess for you personally, is there any one or product or service you’d like to give a shout out to?
Julian
At the moment, and we’ve found this through PropTech Brisbane is it’s those industry leaders that are at the top of the tree, have really no incentive or don’t have to go outside their office and start trialling stuff and put their neck on the line, engage mentor, invest in potentially personally in these start-ups, but do anyway. It’s such a big help and it’s so encouraging to see, especially here in Brisbane, but I think all up in all over Australia, that there are there’s a growing number of these senior executives and property professionals that are willing to spend their own personal time, and in some cases, personal capital, on these start-ups when they really don’t have any need to. And I give a shout out to those guys that are really the trailblazers at the moment. And soon that trend will become just a fundamental, but it’s those guys taking the first step and kind of looking like a little bit of the odd ball or spending those extra few hours every other week. engaging and mentoring like that, big props.
Louisa
Thank you for that Julian, and Isaac is anyone product service you’d like to give a shout out to?
Isaac
Yes, absolutely. And I’m going to be far less polite than Julian. I think everyone doing their bit for the community deserves the praise but there’s a couple companies at the moment we’re working with, that people should be googling. And in my mind, one of the top ones is Hutly, which is a very successful PropTech here in greater Brisbane has recently closed an $8 million round and is servicing the property management side of the residential real estate industry. They are led by a gentleman named Jeremy Hastings, you do not want to miss this gentleman or the company that has been built, it is phenomenal. Looking a little bit earlier than that, there’s an awesome start-up that is really servicing the commercial real estate and retail space at the moment from the way of data analytics and thermo mapping. The company’s name is Space Platform. It is held up by a gentleman named Cina, and it is completely revolutionising the way that people engage with and are able to be mapped in the built environment and they are probably my two absolute top picks for products at the moment.
Louisa
I love that, everyone listening check them out. And now we’ve come on to the regrets in career, that lots of people say it’s not taking enough risk, or going out and starting their own business sooner, but Julian go for it.
Julian
Yes I think it’s just getting in earlier. I think that Isaac and I are both so engaged in the space now and to be more of what we’re doing at this point in time, really is going to come from a longer tenure within this space. So the regret would be not starting sooner, I think that would be the big one there. But other than that, there’s no major regrets, everything’s led to this point. And again, very happy where I’m at the moment so there’s no major regrets at this point in time.
Louisa
Hopefully not in the future either! Isaac, what about you?
Isaac
I think my single biggest regret, and it’s happened a couple times is I get sold on the dream and I get sold on the inspiration and I lose sight of the tangible. And I think that is something that I’ve struggled with. I am an enthusiast, I love the excitement of PropTech. But unfortunately of my career, I think I’ve been sold a couple times too heavily on the dream, without doing the appropriate level of legwork to really understand what is this organisation actually was what it says it is and what it claims to be. So biggest regret and hopefully anyone else who’s listening can learn from is, get excited, I love being excited but don’t lose track of what is tangible and don’t lose track of what is possible.
Louisa
I like that. And the last part of the podcast and is what you’re most excited about in terms of the future of PropTech. So Julian, why don’t you finish us off, what are you most excited about?
Julian
I think I’m most excited about a few more platform players coming together a bit more consolidation. One of the big trends in the property space in Australia at the moment is the build to rent. I think it’s known as PRS and multifamily in the States. And it’s really an emerging sector here in Australia. And I think that that’s just going to bring so much more innovation, whether it’s the internationals coming to Australia on shoring, and of course they’re going to start in Brisbane, or it’s the local PropTech community really rising to the challenge that they’re built around or multifamily presents. And there’s a lot of huge international property giants that are investing here alongside local partners. And they’re all really hungry to solve a lot of the issues around that. So that’s like a very specific area that I’m going to see how it evolves.
Louisa
Awesome thank you for that. And Isaac last but not least, what are you most excited about? But if you can maybe narrow it down to a one or two?
Isaac
Yes, I think we’re going to narrow it down to one. What I’m most excited about is for PropTech, no longer to be a buzzword, for PropTech no longer to be the new thing. PropTech is not a new industry. It is a subset of the property industry. And it is the digital solutions and R&D arm of a phenomenal sector that has created hundreds and thousands of jobs globally around the world and has created incredible opportunities. And PropTech is just the next evolution of the property industry. So I’m really excited for when we reach that point where PropTech doesn’t need its own stage, it’s just a subset of the property industry. And it’s accepted and embraced that way.
Louisa
Yes, I agree with that. Unfortunately, Julia and Isaac, it’s probably quite late for you guys and you want to go crack a cold one and so we’ve come to the end of the show. But please, can you let the audience know what’s the best way to connect with both of you to hear about your businesses and also of course connected with PropTech Brisbane?
Julian
Yes, I think the easiest way to connect with us is LinkedIn. You can connect with myself there send me a message, an email, and also from PropTech Brisbane as well just that that’s where you’re going to find us and where you’re going to stay across what we’re up to and some of the initiatives that we’re running. So that’s the best and easiest place I’d say.
Isaac
Echoing Julian, LinkedIn is then hit us up there. Both of us are very active on it and so is PropTech Brisbane. If you’re interested to know more that is that that is the avenue to get us on.
Louisa
Awesome. Thank you guys both for joining us on the podcast and looking forward to catching up with you after the show. Thank you for joining us this week on the podcast and a big thanks to our guests and our sponsors CREtech and Reimtech. Make sure you visit our website www.lmre.tech where you can subscribe to our newsletter, keep up with our industry news and events or if you’re looking for your next career move it’s all on there. The Propcast can be found on iTunes, Spotify and YouTube where all good content is found. Whilst you’re at it, if you found value in the show, we’d appreciate if you could spread the word and tell and friend about it or even write us a review, and I’ll catch you next week.
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