Built Environment Through Innovation and Solutions with Brad Dockser and Jake Dockser

About Our Host

Louisa Dickins

https://www.linkedin.com/in/louisa-dickins-ab065392/?originalSubdomain=uk

Louisa started her career in property working at a well-known estate agency in London. Realising her people skills, she moved over to Lloyd May to pursue a career in recruitment. She now is a Director at LMRE, who are a specialist recruitment firm driven by PropTech and recruitment professionals, and Louisa oversees their 5 core areas. Louisa co-founded LMRE and provides a constructive recruitment platform to the new disruptors in real estate. Louisa is also on the board of Directors at UK PropTech Association (UKPA).

About LMRE

LMRE believe there is a better way to recruit. LMRE focus on a more comprehensive, client led focus delivering exceptional talent to the right place at the right time. They are passionate about the industry and passionate about people’s careers. LMRE spend time with each client to become and an extension of the business, and their transparency and core values help them grow with the sector. LMRE simplify recruitment and innovate with our clients and evolve the people driven, PropTech community.

About Our Guest

Brad Dockser

https://www.linkedin.com/in/brad-dockser-83467018

Bradford H. Dockser is the Chief Executive Officer and Co-Founder of GreenGeneration, which engineers and implements comprehensive integrated energy efficiency solutions that lower operating costs while improving sustainability on behalf of a diverse set of clients worldwide. Founded in 2011, GreenGen transforms the world’s built environment through innovation and solutions by integrating energy, real estate, technology, and capital markets to Operate in the Green. GreenGen helps its clients use energy as a driver of value across all asset types in North America, the Caribbean, Europe, and Asia. GreenGen’s turnkey approach to energy efficiency is implemented by a team that includes electrical, lighting, mechanical, and environmental engineers, PhDs, tradesmen, as well as real estate and finance experts.

Jake Dockser

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jacobdockser

Jake Dockser is Vice President, Ventures at GreenGen where he is primarily responsible for identifying and investing in property-related technologies that lower operating costs in the built environment. Prior to GreenGen, Jake spent over two years working in the administration of President Barack Obama as the Special Assistant for International Trade and Investment under Secretary Penny Pritzker and Under Secretary Stefan Selig at the Department of Commerce. Jake was involved in achieving President Obama’s robust trade agenda, including two major negotiations (TPP and US-EU Privacy Shield). Responsible for attracting foreign direct investment into the US and helping US businesses operate internationally, Jake traveled to more than 25 countries, including extensive travel to China. His expertise in identifying key actors in foreign markets has been invaluable to GreenGen’s operations

Resources Mentioned in Episode

LMRE website www.lmre.co.uk

UKPA website www.ukpa.com

GreenGeneration website www.greengen.com

Wynd www.hellowynd.com

Senseware www.senseware.co

Conservation Labs www.conservationlabs.com

Datakwip www.datakwip.com

Insights From This Episode

• We are finding demand for those who understand the financial side of climate change and the financial side of upgrading assets in high demand – Brad Dockser
• One of the things that is going to become increasingly important, if it isn’t already, is transparency – Jake Dockser
• What we’re finding is that we’re helping people understand how the environment and climate is profitable – Brad Dockser
• People want to work at companies that reflect their values, whether it be social values or related to the environment, and sustainability – Jake Dockser
• The overall trends of the business are extremely positive, and we are seeing growth – Brad Dockser

Episode Transcript

Louisa

Hi, everyone, and welcome to the Propcast. My name is Louisa Dickins, co-founder of LMRE and board director of the UKPA, and I shall be a weekly host. Each week for 30 minutes, we will be connecting the VCs, PropTech startups and real estate professionals globally, and assist in bridging that famous communication gap we all love talking about. So sit back, relax and enjoy the show. Hi, everyone, and welcome back to the Propcast. Today is a family affair and we are lucky enough to be joined by both Brad and Jake Dockser from GreenGeneration and we will be talking about the built environment for innovation and solution. So welcome to the show, Brad and Jake.

Brad

Very nice to be here. Thanks for having us.

Jake

Thank you for having us. Happy to be here.

Louisa

And for those who are listening GreenGen is an award-winning company that operates at the intersection of energy, real estate, technology and capital markets. Their client driven focus delivers financial outcomes, while driving sustainability making the world a better place. GreenGen operates in five integrated platforms, that is solutions, ventures, analytics, trading and property. The headquarters are in Washington DC and regional offices in London, Tokyo and Shanghai. Now Brad is a chief executive officer, as well as being the co-founder of GreenGen, and has had an interesting and extremely global journey to get to the place where he is today. Now during his time, and I think more than two decades of real estate investing, Brad was a principal with national real estate investment firm McFarlane Partners, overseeing activities of the Mid-Atlantic business and founding Managing Director for Starwood Capital Europe overseeing operations, direct investments, and operating JVs and financing activities throughout Europe. Now he founded Starwood Capital Asia and was responsible for the firm’s Asian operations. But before all of that, Brad began his career with JMB Realty, then the largest real estate firm in the United States, and later with CRI Inc, the nation’s largest owner multifamily residential properties at the time. And also for all our UK listeners, Brad has also lived and worked in lovely Bristol, which we’ll hear a little bit more about later.

And now for Jake’s introduction, Jake is the Vice President of ventures of GreenGen, where he is primarily responsible for identifying and investing in property related technologies that lower operating costs in the built environment. And prior to GreenGen, Jake spent over two years working in the administration of President Barack Obama as a special assistant for international trade and investment. Jake was involved in achieving President Obama’s for robust trade agenda, including two major negotiations, which we can learn about later. Responsible for attracting foreign direct investment into the US and helping us businesses operate internationally, Jake has travelled to over 25 countries including extensive travel throughout China. His expertise in identifying key actors in foreign markets has been invaluable to GreenGenerations operations. After this Jake spent a year at Activism Blizzard in Santa Monica California, reporting directly to the CEO Bobby Kotick, where he was responsible for the initial round of team sales for the firm’s Overwatch Pro League. Now, welcome to you both, big warm welcome and let’s start with the podcast. So, Brad tell us what inspired you to start GreenGeneration? And what’s the story behind it?

Brad

Louisa, thanks, and good morning. So usually when I started talking about GreenGen and the story I go way back, really just to  set it up, because it really helps make the point. , I spent the first 20 years of my professional life in real estate private equity. As you mentioned, I started JMB in Chicago, then spent a decade at Starwood capital, founding the business, both in Asia and Europe. And the reality is that prior to 2008, real estate broadly, private equity broadly, really only focused on top line, all the focus was on driving revenue. If you looked at an investment memo from that period, he was 98/99% on the top line with a little bit of mention that expenses are margins. That fell apart in 2008, with the global financial crisis, and all of a sudden as top lines are collapsing and bottom lines are deteriorating, many of us began to look at expenses, looking for any way to mitigate this collapse of our cash flow. What we found was quite interesting because in fact, there was this big line item – energy, electric water, gas and steam, that was not only really big, but it turns out it was much more controllable than people had often thought.

And so the ability to focus on reducing energy costs would in turn drive your cash flow and your assets. But when we went to look for people to help us think about it, all we really found were a lot of consultants who essentially wanted to tell us what to do but neither implement nor execute, or people that wanted to sell their product, buy my software, my window, my motor, my device, and we felt there was just a different approach. And as we spoke to friends at other real estate firms and other private equity firms asking who owned this category, who helps you think about lowering energy related operating costs, it turns out that there really wasn’t anybody focused on the investor class, the financial community in this way. And so my wife and I, who had met at JMB Realty out of University, founded GreenGen in 2011. And from the beginning, our focus was to really drive a financial outcome relative to energy, but then have the co-benefits of sustainability and resiliency as a byproduct from this. In this way, we were able to articulate both a financial outcome but an environmental or climate driven outcome.

Louisa

Tell us a little bit more about how your roles are defined within these areas?

Brad

Well, so when we first started we did one thing, we would assess an asset or a portfolio, we engineer the solution, and then we execute it to get the outcome. The outcome was always a financial outcome. People quickly said, Hey, if it makes sense when we already own it, then what about when we’re buying it, financial due diligence, or when we’re building it, design peer review. And then we just kept looking at different ways where there was an intersection of not only the energy piece, but the capital markets and real estate piece. That led us into creating a data analytics platform, which we use both as a measurement and verification tool for solutions. In other words, if you expect savings of say £100,000, to make certain that you got it, and to understand where it’s coming from. We naturally as an integrator, we’re always using and interacting with new technologies, as we look to address different types of problems in the built environment. That led us into ventures, we recognize that another way to create return from our work was to look at the carbon reduction that we were making. That led us into offsets, and then finally the recognition that despite the fact that our clients, some of the world’s leading investors own lots of assets, they don’t own all the assets. And so when there are assets or opportunities, that we can become a principal, essentially using our principal experience, to invest and drive a both financial return, but also to thinking about you integrating the energy expertise we have, we’ll do that. And so, from some people on the outside, they look at these five different businesses as  detached, we actually think that they’re quite integrated. And really, the fact that we have the solutions business with electrical, mechanical lighting, and environmental engineers, located around the world looking at technologies and buildings and problems and solutions, it has allowed us to find simply different ways to monetise the expertise we have. And that’s where our business sits today.

Louisa

Yes, and then Jake to bring you in on this, you’re obviously very involved in the venture side of the business. Two questions, what is it like to work with your parents, I don’t know if I personally could do that! And tell us a little bit more how the ventures coincides with the other four areas as well, and how you built that out?

Jake

Yes, I’ll start by saying this, I consider myself extremely fortunate and lucky to be able to work with my parents. It’s simplifying and complicating at the same time to have your parents also be your boss. But I think we’re pretty good at it at this point, and I’m really enjoying it and happy that they happy they hired me.

Louisa

Thanks, Dad! And tell us more about the venture business, you’ve played an integral part in growing it, looking at it in the businesses sense, I’d love to hear a little bit more about it.

Jake

So the venture business really grew out of a kind of a conversation, I think was over one of these holidays where we were talking as a family about how do we leverage this technological expertise and business experience? How do we leverage that into something that brings value not just to investors and to companies, but to GreenGen as well. And prior to meet my joining and prior to the venture business as a whole, we were doing pilots and testing technologies, just because that’s built into the company’s DNA. It’s always been about finding the best technologies and the most innovative solutions to deliver value for clients. What we were what we were seeing was that we were identifying these companies, because we were doing these real world pilots and in many cases that provide a great service to potential investors.

They got a technical review, in many cases engineering review, and to the companies that some of them didn’t have real world data sets yet. And that can be an incredibly valuable set of data. And what we saw was companies raising a lot of money, investors making a lot of money, and we were just doing the pilots. And so as we tried to discuss how do we capture some of this value, we landed upon “Let’s continue to do what we do, we aren’t going to change anything that we do. We’re going to continue pilots. And now if we identify what we find to be a promising technology or a winner so to speak, then well, let’s invest in it. Let’s have a vehicle to take advantage of that work.” And then my dad looked across the table, I was living in LA at the time and he said, “Do you want to come home and run it?” And you’ll be surprised I wasn’t a huge fan of LA and I was missing the East Coast, and I said yes. And I went back to Los Angeles after, and I think it might have been like two weeks later, I got a text message with “We’re going to New York, meet me in New York” and I met my dad in New York in the airport, and he handed me business cards. Off to the races.

Louisa

I love that, straight to business. And since then you’ve invested in how many companies, is that something like four companies? Conservation Labs, Senseware, Datakwip. These businesses you invested in, what do you look for?

Jake

Yes, so there are four companies that we’ve invested in to date, you’ve just mentioned three of them. The fourth one is Wynd. And for us, each of them plays a strategic portent area, especially right now, Senseware is an IoT platform and solution that essentially can take older buildings and I hesitate to use the word dumb, but we use the word smart so much that I’ll say older not connected buildings, and a very easily and manageable way to bring those systems and those buildings online. And then it’s an old smart building, and that’s Senseware.

Wynd is an air quality sensor and purifier company based in Silicon Valley that we’re really excited about, and they’re very busy with air quality, especially right now. And then Conservation Labs is a company from Pittsburgh, that is a water risk mitigation and water management system. It’s kind of the first of its kind, it uses acoustics to listen to the flows of the water inside the pipes as a way of monitoring flow and identifying deviations from what it should sound like. And that’s a massive quite frankly unaddressed market, especially as it relates to insurance claims. Water incidents are increasing not just in frequency, but also in severity. And in many cases, the insurance companies are the ones left holding the bag, you never hear about someone having a small water leak are a small water damage. If it happens its large. And that can be extremely difficult for a commercial asset to survive, be resilient through. So we’re really excited about Conservation Labs. And then the fourth is Datakwip, which is a company actually out of Maryland that provides an enterprise cloud based energy analytics software that detects and helps reduce energy usage, using the existing equipment in the building and no additional hardware. And it’s pretty cool, during this pandemic there’s been additional challenges related to doing things like retrofitting and renovations, and actually with Datakwip, we were able to remotely install their software into a building and essentially bring the building online highly remotely. So Datakwip is another company that we are actively deploying both over in Asia and Europe as well.

Louisa

That’s impressive

Brad

And Louisa let me just add to that, because I think the four companies Jake just took us through, each one of them is addressing what we identified as a really big problem and this is where we’ve had great advantage if you will. Our engineering team is assessing all manner of assets and asset types around the world, we’re identifying the issues that the owners and the engineers are trying to address and looking for solutions for. And each of these companies was a result of not necessarily looking for investment, but rather looking for a solution to a problem we identified as big. In all cases, we work with these companies for some period of time, long before we considered even investing, in no case where these companies looking for money when we first met them, they were looking for clients. And so rather than taking an investment point of view should we invest, we took the engineering perspective, should we use this product, we use this technology, is it better than alternatives? And that’s what’s really exciting about how we’ve gone at this. And we end up with a lot of insights, essentially asymmetrical information about what these technologies can do, how do they work, and how effective are they long before there’s a financial question or an investment decision to be made.

Louisa

And Jake mentioned how you get some of these businesses to launch globally, Brad you’ve grown GreenGen and your whole team to offer it globally, are there certain countries or regions where you’ve seen more of an uptake in looking for you to help them with a solution or areas of growth you’ve seen?

Brad

I’m not sure that I could tell you that there’s one region more than another. What we’re seeing right now are the twin trends of capital markets, essentially investors telling real estate investment firms and private equity firms that they need to find ways to address ESG and sustainability in their operations, in their investment process. And at the same time, investors simply recognising that for a long period of time, there was a large category of spend, namely energy that they simply were missing, they weren’t really focused on. And so we’re deeply focused on reducing electric, water, gas and steam. In recent years, we’ve done a lot of work around repairs and maintenance, a lot of work around insurance, Conservation Labs is primarily not addressing the use of water so much, it’s not so much a water efficiency play, but it’s much more focused on insurance, tech, and essentially, the ability to reduce the cost of insurance or the claims associated with water leaks.

We’re taking the asset offline. And so that’s really how we looked at it. I will tell you this, that during the pandemic, we have seen an acceleration of our business in Asia, we’ve got numerous projects in Japan, Korea, China, Hong Kong, right now we’re looking at some things in Oceana imminently, but also in Europe. And if you go fast forward and look at all of the budgets, all the regulations, all the political discussion around how to recover with the notable exception of the United States, you’re seeing sustainability, you’re seeing climate and the environment as an integral part of all the recovery plans, 2 trillion euros in the EU. Japan, noting that it’s going to be carbon neutral by 2060, 2050 in Korea, China, 18.21 what you’re seeing across the board is people linking economic development and business and investment growth to the climate in the environment. And with those things happening, we are finding demand for those who understand the financial side of climate change and the financial side of upgrading assets in high demand.

Louisa

That answers my next question about how their pandemic has impacted your business, but if we’re going a little bit more into it, this is quite a general question and I’m sure you get asked this a lot. I doubt that there’s plenty of challenges, don’t get me wrong, but what would you say maybe the biggest challenges in real estate today? Is it convincing the funds to focus on it? It sounds from what you just said there seems to be more of an interest in uptake and looking at these solutions. But is it anything you could pinpoint from what you’ve seen?

Brad

Well, I don’t think there’s a universal answer across all of real estate. As an example, in hospitality, people are questioning whether or not all hotels need to exist. And what you saw is a vast majority of hotels closing. Now they’re coming back online, but do we need as many hotels, will business travel post pandemic look the same as it did pre pandemic? Office space, there’s obviously lots of discussion and perhaps no more impacted asset class than office, because people are now getting used to working remotely. And so will we have the same demand for office space, maybe fewer people, but at the same time are the people going to need more space because we had really shrunk the number of square feet or square meters per employee to a much lower number and when people travelling less, you’ve got lots of assumptions and underlying ideas working back and forth. But certainly one of the biggest challenges we have right now in the short term is access, because we’re seeing lots of rules changing all the time. And so we have a portfolio for instance, in Europe right now of hotels and we are trying to figure out based on where our people are, and where they reside, and where the assets are, who can go where. And the rules that exist this week may not be the same rules as next week as the number of cases rises and falls, and governments change the rules to protect their citizens. And so that’s a real challenge, when you’re trying to make medium term plans to have all these very short-term changes.

Louisa

Well, it’s probably a good thing you’ve got five different parts to your business plan Brad and Jake! So it’s fairly difficult to make a prediction going forward about what might happen. I guess it’s also hard to measure, but where are you seeing some of the most successful headway made across each of the divisions of your business?

Brad

Well I just go back to something I said a moment ago, it is hard to know day to day how we’re going to execute various parts of our business, it is not hard for us to see what the overall trends of the business look like. The overall trends of the business are extremely positive, and we are seeing growth, not only in all the businesses that we’re in, but in all the places that we do what we do. So that continues really quite unabated. And what we’re finding is that we’re helping people understand how the environment and climate is profitable. It’s really simple, for a long period of time, people generally thought of climate or sustainability as a cost, be more sustainable – what will that cost me? Even politicians and governments often do this. And what we’re simply doing is we’re going one step further.

And there’s the basic concept in business called cost benefit. Usually investors and governments stop at cost, and we’re simply helping to articulate very clearly the benefits. And that’s both in terms of hard ROI and soft ROI, hard ROI simply being either reducing expenses or increasing various revenue, so that the cash flow improves the asset values driven. But there’s also soft ROI health and safety is something that everyone thought was important, prior to COVID but no one really wanted to spend a lot of money on, people now want to spend money on health and safety, they’ll spend money and they like health, they like productivity, they like reduced health insurance costs. Those are really hard things to quantify. But all we have to agree, is that there’s no negative value to those things. And if there’s no negative value, and having these softer ROI, that come on top of the hard ROI, are simply additive. And then once you’re doing this work, you have the ability to  baseline and measure and see if those returns came, and then you can start to find additional hard ROI is based on your data and your evidence that you can use to make future investment decisions.

Louisa

And Jake, on your side? Are there any products out there that you see succeeding? Obviously, we touched upon some air quality, water, everything like that, are there any areas which the real estate and private equity firms really should be maybe taking up or using these products to differentiate themselves?

Jake

Yes, I think for us, our main focus, and I have to narrow my focus too, is on the actual built building envelope itself. However, that being said, I think that more as a sign of the times than anything one of the things that is going to become increasingly important, if it isn’t already is transparency. I think that for a long time, companies were just location, location, location. Now we are in an environment and I think it’s going to continue in this direction of the experience is just as important and people want to work at companies that reflect their values, whether it be social values or related to the environment, and sustainability. And consequently, companies are going to be pushed to find office space and find real estate that satisfies their employees, in many ways it’s now become part of talent, retention and acquisition and so all of that to say I think the buildings that will succeed and maintain occupancy and lease out, especially given everyone’s remoteness is going to be those buildings that implement the steps now to mitigate their impact on the environment and also communicate what they’re doing how it’s doing in real time in terms of transparency, data transparency

Brad

Yes, and Louisa let me just add to that. What we’re seeing is that the pandemic and COVID are creating costs that weren’t anticipated pre pandemic. Those costs include things like insurance, so we’re seeing more claims relative to COVID and air quality, we’re seeing costs for water go up, because of the lack of investment in infrastructure, so more water leaks across the world. And we’re also seeing a trend, which may be exacerbated and accelerated by the US election, which is coming up shortly, around a price on carbon. And all these are things that are imposing additional costs on businesses and real estate assets. The minute a cost is imposed is the minute we have the ability to use technology and best practices to mitigate that cost and drive the value. So let me give you an example. We’ve seen increasingly an interest in health and safety. But what’s really driving this now, is the risk of insurance claims or other claims against the business and assets. Senior living for instance, how do you measure and how do you give people comfort that the air quality is good? And so once that’s in place, that both potentially impacts occupancy. People don’t want to be in a building or don’t want to have their parents somewhere where they can’t be certain of the safety, but also potential legal claims. And so now the ability to filter the air better in terms of air flows, in terms of air quality, but also the potential and the necessity of presenting data and quantifying “what does healthy air mean?” is now something that can be quantified, you can link it to a financial outcome. And those are the types of things that we’re really focused on.

We think about a product ultimately is simply manifesting an investment theme, the more important thing for us right now is thinking about the investment themes. And that continues to be the Internet of Things, controls and sensors in the built environment that will turn things on and off and regulate them, air quality, insurance tech

Louisa

That covers almost everything, I know even as a tenant I’m looking at different things which our landlord can incorporate in, especially during everything that’s happening at the moment. This aside, because I’m conscious that we’re coming nearly to the end of the podcast, and I want to hear a little bit more from both you about your journeys as well to where we are now. Jake, what was it like working in administration of President Barack Obama as Special Assistant? That’s pretty impressive, and what was it like moving over to MD of GreenGeneration, very different roles? It’s fascinating.

Jake

Yes, very different to say the least! I was incredibly fortunate to be able to serve under President Obama after college, especially at such an interesting and impactful time as it relates to the trade international trade regime. I think it was 2017 that the Financial Times called it the year of trade. And they weren’t kidding, we were super busy. But I think from that experience as you mentioned, I got to visit 27 different countries, China 19 times, and got to work on two rather large and impactful trade agreements, one of which had me in Brussels quite often was what we called Safe Harbor, which ended up being GDPR and Safe Harbor Data Trade agreement that came out of the Snowden Fallout. And it gave me an incredible worldview, I got to learn about specific issues in each corner of the world and it was an incredible experience. And then the election cycle begins and people start to leave and governments say “let’s pick this back up after the election” because they know that no matter who wins the election, it won’t be Barack Obama. So if there’s kind of a lame duck internationally as well.

So at that point, I just had to figure out what I wanted to do next and ended up in LA and got to work on another space, eSports that was very different as well, kind of adding different tools to my toolkit, so to speak. And in many ways that ended up being a similarly an international type of job because it’s a city based league and it was worldwide, so I got to use some of that experience and network to do that. And how does that fit back with GreenGen and it’s another thing that the beginning that was relatively unique and new. But I think that given the experiences I’ve had, it’s been able to provide a good bellwether and guide me in how we operate. Because we are a global firm and our search for technologies is not limited to any one geography. So utilising and leveraging that network of people I’ve met from all over the world, as well as the different startup ecosystems and technology ecosystems that I became familiar with has been kind of invaluable, I think.

Louisa

No, I bet and talking of different geographies, Brad you’ve obviously done your stint in the UK. Tell us a little bit about your time in Bristol, and how it’s impacted a little bit of your life and business now.

Brad

Ah, Bristol is a beautiful city. So when I was younger, I was a footballer of English football in the US. And was fortunate when I was 18 to have the opportunity to come and join Bristol Rovers in 1980. And it was really quite an extraordinary experience. I had a university acceptance at Harvard, so I had what I’ll call a world class Plan B, and I came over in August of that year. And it was quite an interesting year, the first week of the season, our stadium burned down and we ended up sharing with Bristol City for the entire season, because our stadium wasn’t available and it really went downhill from there. And ultimately, fast forward to the spring, we ended up getting relegated from what was then the second to the third, and the experience of relegation if you haven’t gone through it either as a diehard fan or as a member of an organisation or a player, there is nothing comparable in the United States experience. In the US if you don’t win, at the bottom basically the worst team gets a draft choice and there’s actually a prize for being the worst team. There is no prize for being at the bottom of the league table in the UK.

But I think there are two outtakes, one despite the fact that we were relegated there was a tremendous amount of young talent on this team. My manager at the time was Terry Cooper, who would come from Leeds and was one of the leading wingbacks for England and Leeds back in the day. But at the same time, Gary Mabbott was a 21 year old winger went on to Skipper Tottenham to the FA Cup. Keith Curl, who ended up as a Skipper at Man City was on the team, Ian Holloway who had a long career and ended up as the manager of Blackpool. There was some tremendous talent, and as a goalkeeper I think that the most important thing is, if you’re a really good goalkeeper in many respects you have to make very few saves, because what you end up doing is, you end up positioning all the rest of the talent on the field in the right place making your job very easy. And as a CEO, it’s no different. My job is to basically help get the best talent on the field and put them in the right positions to succeed. And when you do that, both as a goalkeeper you have the best view of the pitch because you’re really looking out across everything, but you also have the easiest job because  everything is done prior to it getting to you. You end up only having to clean things up and everybody else does the hard work for you.

Louisa

I didn’t think I’d hit all these comparisons of Tottenham and what you are doing now, but I completely understand now. Also quite a journey. Guys, this has been an absolute terrific  podcast and we’re going to have to come to an end of it, but I’m sure there’s a bit of parting advice you could give some of the listeners and also the best way for them to connect with both of you and GreenGeneration.

Brad

Yes, so it’s really easy, we’re not hiding – website is www.greengen.com  and then just my first name and my last name, Brad Dockser are easy to find on LinkedIn, easy to find on Twitter. I would encourage people to follow us on LinkedIn. We’re robust in terms of both white papers and research, but also as an aggregator of lots of research from the industry, I sit on the global board for Urban Land Institute, global board for Sustainability and Technology and so those are all good ways to find and follow what we’re doing, but also see what’s going on across the industry, because there is so much at this intersection of real estate, capital markets, technology and energy. And from our point of view, there’s no more exciting place to be for the next decade, anywhere in the world than where we are right now.

Louisa

Yes I second that. And Jake any way people can connect with you as well?

Jake

Yes, LinkedIn, email jake@greengen.com, you can find me.

Louisa

Well, thank you both for coming on the podcast. It’s been an absolute pleasure, and I’m looking forward to catching up for you after the show.

Brad and Jake

Thank you, Louisa. Thank you very much.

Louisa

Thank you for joining us this week on the podcast and a big thanks to our special guests. Make sure you visit our website www.lmre.co.uk where you can subscribe to our show. Or you’ll find us on iTunes and Spotify where all good content is found. While you’re at it, if you found value in the show, we’d appreciate if you could rate and review us on iTunes. Or if you simply spread the word. Be sure to tune in next Tuesday, and I’ll catch you later.